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Fogman
USA
227 Posts |
 Posted - 07/19/2010 : 7:12:10 PM
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First of all, congratulations to Team Landlocked. You guys obviously fished great on Saturday! As for our team, we tried "heroing or zeroing" uplake. You all see the results Now on to the main reason for my post.
What happened to reducing the weigh-in limit to 18 inches for our Clarks Hill tournaments? I know it would require a bylaws change; however, we are just in our 2nd year of having tournaments on that lake. That's a drastic change in and of itself, and our tournament rules were written with Lake Murray in mind.
If 18 inches is good enough for SBCC and Clarks Hill Striper Club(the guys who fish that lake regularly), why isn't it good enough for us. A 19-20 inch hybrid can be north of 4 pounds. It hurts to have to turn that good of a fish loose on a tough day.
Want to get more people interested in fishing the Hill? Want to make the weigh-ins better attended? Well, 13 fish weighed by 12 boats isn't going accomplish any of that. 18 to 20 inch hybrids are plentiful, and I think our membership as a whole would feel better about fishing Clarks Hill knowing they could at least catch something for the scales.
It's worth thinking about. I look forward to any discussion. |
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Chipman
USA
48 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2010 : 8:47:32 PM
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I wuold not have a problem with 18" fish on the Hill. After Saturday I do think we should at least consider why we are there. If it is just to fish a different lake then we do that. If it is because we catch better fish then maybe we should reconsider Murray for August.
Chipman |
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Tom Gitto
222 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2010 : 8:52:52 PM
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I have recieved 4 phone calls since sat. on just that matter and I agree we should change the size limit to 18 in. for clarks hill .. Feb tx weighin was 3 fish , and hasn;t gotten much better since then in terms of sizable fish weighed in.. there are lots of hybrids witch are called guide fish by the locals and would make those txs more competitive.. we'll also discuss it at the PAC meeting the 3rd of August. Thanks Fog..
Tom Gitto |
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VanMan
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2010 : 9:04:52 PM
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If we keep catching 18" fish and have to keep lowering limits we might as well quit fishing for a year or two and let these kids grow up if the lakes don't kill them first...
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Rick
USA
466 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 08:30:09 AM
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I totally agree that we should have a minimum size limit for the Hill of 18 inches. The Hybrids are plentiful, fun to catch, and would surely make our weigh-in's more interesting and fun for all. It would surely be nice to see every boat weigh fish in a tournament, some day
Rick
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landlocked
USA
116 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 11:36:32 AM
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I guess I am on the fence....
1. Why are we having to discuss fish under 21 inches on a lake that normally has no problem producing quality Striped Bass. The lake is obviuosly been devistated by the fish kill last August.
2. The main reason we chose to move to Clarks Hill was to reduce the mortality of short fish on Murray during July & August. Clarks Hill, in my personal opinion, is in worst shape than Murray.
3. Lake Murray has seemed to make a signifigant turn to the positive as it related to Striped Bass being caught over 21 inches. I know we are closing in the "dog days" of summer, but I hope we don't see what we did last year.
With all this being said I have to ask why are we going to Clarks Hill? Believe me I am all about fishing Lakes other than Murray, but to me the rewards are slim at this point. The last two MSC events have been horrible (again my opinion) as it relates to producing quality fish on Clarks Hill. I know hind sight is 20-20, but I am thinking we need to discuss this further in the PAC and make some changes that will best represent MSC and what we stand for.
My 2 Cents
Richy
"My biggest worry is that my wife (when I'm dead) will sell my fishing gear for what I said I paid for it." |
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steelytom
USA
134 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 2:43:44 PM
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| Any thoughts to moving to Russel or Hartwell. Conditions have changed on Clark Hill and Murray since the decision was made to move some tournaments there. I know it's farther away, but it doesn't make sense to drive the 1.5 hours to Clark Hill when the fishing is better here on Murray. It also looks like Lake Marion is recovering quite nicely, maybe move one their down the road. |
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Rick
USA
466 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 6:13:15 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by landlocked
I guess I am on the fence....
1. Why are we having to discuss fish under 21 inches on a lake that normally has no problem producing quality Striped Bass. The lake is obviuosly been devistated by the fish kill last August.
2. The main reason we chose to move to Clarks Hill was to reduce the mortality of short fish on Murray during July & August. Clarks Hill, in my personal opinion, is in worst shape than Murray.
3. Lake Murray has seemed to make a signifigant turn to the positive as it related to Striped Bass being caught over 21 inches. I know we are closing in the "dog days" of summer, but I hope we don't see what we did last year.
With all this being said I have to ask why are we going to Clarks Hill? Believe me I am all about fishing Lakes other than Murray, but to me the rewards are slim at this point. The last two MSC events have been horrible (again my opinion) as it relates to producing quality fish on Clarks Hill. I know hind sight is 20-20, but I am thinking we need to discuss this further in the PAC and make some changes that will best represent MSC and what we stand for.
My 2 Cents
Richy
In the Feb SBCC tournament (at the Hill) they had a 30 and a 23 lb'er weighed. In the May tournament they had 5 fish over 23 lbs, and one boat fishing multiple tournaments, had either 4 or 5 fish that weighed 107 lbs, I think.
That being said, I have asked at about every tournament "tell me again why we are going to the Hill"?
I am open to fishing other lakes, but if we do, we need to modify our size limits to match the SBCC or local club rules, e.g. don't have 21" limits on lakes that SBCC or local club's for that lake have 18" limits!!!!!!!!!!
I'd be open to adding Hartwell and/or Wateree to our schedule, with maybe only one tournament on any lake other than Murray in a single year.
Rick
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Jon Boy
USA
145 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 8:42:08 PM
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To me, the answer is simple. If you are trying to give members some variety and a change of pace and people are bored fishing Murray, fish lakes other than Murray. If you are trying to have the largest number of boats participating, limit the tournaments to Murray.
When the decision was made to fish other lakes, it was made in an effort to relieve summer mortality on Murray, which we all knew was already suffering from the fish kill and heavy pressure. The 21" limit was kept because the club did not want to give the impression that we were not being good stewards of the resource, and not allowing the fish to grow to good size. Subsequently, Clarks Hill suffered a fish kill that, as it turns out, was probably as bad as Murray. Doesn't make the decision right or wrong. The PAC had to do something and did what it thought was best at the time. No reason that can't be adjusted and modified as conditions change.
Whether or not you allow 18" fish to be weighed or not is, in my opinion, irrelevent. The same teams/fishermen will win and finish near the top regardless. Changing our points system, AOTY points, and TOTY points separation has not resulted in any change in results whatsoever. Further, nobody has to throw back a fish that is legal to keep; you can still keep them, you just can't weigh them in.
The rules are the rules. Eveyone is fishing to the same rules. There's a lot to be said for those teams and fishermen that study the rules, then plan their tournament strategy to give them the best chance of winning. Do you fish for a big fish, taking a chance on zeroing, or do you fish for your weigh-in of keepers. Both strategies can work, but the team with the right strategy on that particular day will still win. No changes to systems or points or limits is going to change that. It will only change the strategy.
The only question in my opinion that the PAC and tournament directors need to ask is, what is best for the club and what will give us the best participation at this point in time. I believe the PAC and tournament directors have done a great job of that in the past, and trust them completely to come up with a good plan going forward.
Jon Boy |
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Rick
USA
466 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 9:53:33 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Jon Boy
Whether or not you allow 18" fish to be weighed or not is, in my opinion, irrelevent. The same teams/fishermen will win and finish near the top regardless. Changing our points system, AOTY points, and TOTY points separation has not resulted in any change in results whatsoever. Further, nobody has to throw back a fish that is legal to keep; you can still keep them, you just can't weigh them in.
The rules are the rules. Eveyone is fishing to the same rules. There's a lot to be said for those teams and fishermen that study the rules, then plan their tournament strategy to give them the best chance of winning. Do you fish for a big fish, taking a chance on zeroing, or do you fish for your weigh-in of keepers. Both strategies can work, but the team with the right strategy on that particular day will still win. No changes to systems or points or limits is going to change that. It will only change the strategy.
The only question in my opinion that the PAC and tournament directors need to ask is, what is best for the club and what will give us the best participation at this point in time. I believe the PAC and tournament directors have done a great job of that in the past, and trust them completely to come up with a good plan going forward.
Jon Boy
I agree with most of what you said Jon Boy. But, in the Feb. tournament, my team had 6 fish over 20 inches, but not 21 inches. Most were hybrids, that weighed more than our lone 21"+ legal fish. I think we had the tournament won, if the size limit had been 18", and I am sure we would have had more than just 2 boats weigh fish!!
In this past tournament, we had multiple spots where we could catch 18 - 20" Hybrids, but did not waste our bait on them. If it had been an 18" limit, we would have caught our 4 keepers early, and then went looking for bigger fish. The strategy DOES CHANGE, when the legal weigh-in size is lowered!!
My 2 cents!!
Rick
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Rick
USA
466 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2010 : 9:58:09 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by VanMan
If we keep catching 18" fish and have to keep lowering limits we might as well quit fishing for a year or two and let these kids grow up if the lakes don't kill them first...
Van,
I expect the fish less than 21"'s at the Hill, will be harvested at a steady rate by the guides (and local fishermen), such that waiting any number of years, will not change anything!!
JMO,
Rick
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RealityBites
USA
399 Posts |
Posted - 07/21/2010 : 2:02:18 PM
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Catchin small fish don't excite me...I'd rather catch one big fish than ten peanuts... The avg size of the fish in CH will get bigger soon... Why change to make it smaller now and then change it again later when they grow up? All that will accomplish is us keeping more fish and weighing more fish and cleaning more fish and eating more fish... I'm sure the teams that caught a fish over 21 inches also caught several between 18 and 21 inches as well... and the hybrids survive release much better than the stripers...I like the challenge that the 21" minimum represents. It forces you to move around, learn the lake ,and think a little harder... I only saw two floaters the whole weekend and one was at a boat ramp....
TWITTER on tournament day! Fish pics and reports: RealityBites1
"I've spent 85% of my lifes wages on fishing, the rest I just wasted..." |
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VanMan
USA
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/21/2010 : 4:35:30 PM
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Rick, as you probably knew my comment about taking a year or two off was said with tounge in cheek... There is no doubt we all want to fish, catch the best size fish we can, and while doing so preserve (and nurture) these lakes back to health. This is a good forum for ideas and opinions, and I do think the PAC does a great job.
Lets do what is best for the lakes and the club. If the cost or boredom of catching small fish begins to outway the "excitement" of catching fish then I will quit... I do enjoy trying a couple new lakes and especially when you see some of the videos and pictures of the stripers being caught. That said we have to keep those trips limited as far as club tournaments so as many as possible can still participate both economically and conveniently. Maybe we need to schedule one or two non-tournament trips in between some of out tournaments for those wanting to go fellowship and fish other areas. That way we can keep the Midlands in Murray for most tournaments, and still stretch out and try new lakes and techniques in a more relaxed venue.
Just my thought...
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SCStriper1
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 07/21/2010 : 11:47:32 PM
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Just a couple of thoughts/facts on the question at hand.
HYBRID FISHERIES AND 21-INCH TOURNAMENT CREEL: Me personally, I (like Woody stated above) prefer to target striped bass especially in tournaments. But, once you start fishing a combined hybrid/striped bass fishery, you will discover that the techniques can be tweeked to target one more than the other. As Jon Boy states, if the rules change those figuring out these "tweeks" will change their strategies based on the population and size structure of the fishery. From a strictly numbers point, Clarks Hill and Hartwell have hybrid striped bass stocked at a rate of approximately 50% of the total stocked annually. And, less than 50% of that population of hybrid survive to reach greater than 21-inches. If you want to provide a greater opportunity for those participating to be successful at the scale, opening the weigh-in to 18-inch fish will accomplish that, especially for hybrid fisheries. On the other hand, as Woody pointed out, if you leave the size limit at 21-inces, hybrid striped bass survive the warmer water release much better than the stripers do. But from strictly a competition stand point, for those finishing at the top of the leader board, they must catch larger fish under the same rules and conditions as the other anglers on the lake on that day/night. And allowing the smaller size on hybrid fisheries dos actually add a new twist that competitors must be able to add to their tools to be successful on the leader board. For example, I fished in the SK night tournament on Friday night on Clarks Hill. I had a plan to target the big fish for the first half of the tournament and adjust based on the situation for the second half of the tournament. I finishing 5th out of 28-boats with 4-fish that weighed a whopping 14.9-pounds. Three of those fish were over 21-inches and one was 19-inches. I guess you can figure out which half of the tournament I was more successful in.
OTHER LAKES: Concerning the idea of adding other lakes to the MSC tournament schedule, I only fish 1 or 2 MSC tournaments a year so I will not voice an opinion yea or ney on staying only at Lake Murray only. I will give some information that you can use for planning for next year and will voice an opinion concerning tournaments for one fishery. I feel Lake Hartwell is the best striped bass lake in the state right now concerning numbers and size. Santee would be off-limits during the summer months as of July 1st of this year. Also, the tournametn rules would need to be tweeked concerning the size since Santee is 27-inches. Wateree (and Greenwood for that matter) is in pretty good shape but would be a different experience since BB Herring is not a normal baitfish for that water. I believe that both of these lakes are now on an every other year stocking schedule. That leaves Russell suggested by one poster. Two things on Russell. First, no other striper club holds tournaments on Russell since it is not a stocked fishery. Second, as of July 1, 2010, Russell has been selected to be a trophy striped bass fishery and as such the creel limit on Russell is 2-fish per angler and only one of those fish can be over 34-inches. I would hope MSC would not be the first striper club to start holding tournaments on Russell.
I hope some of this information I have provided proves useful.
Warren |
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Rick
USA
466 Posts |
Posted - 07/22/2010 : 09:12:51 AM
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Thanks for the post Warren. You make some excellent points.
Rick
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Tom Gitto
222 Posts |
Posted - 07/22/2010 : 8:58:23 PM
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Thanks Warren, your posts and advice are always welcome.. I do not fish Murray July and August ,to hot and I don;t like killing small fish. Lots of good comments and suggestions on this issue and I think it will be a primary item at the PAC meeting . My vote will be 18'' we will get better participation from our club and it would make it more enjoyable for more members and thier familys if they had fish to weigh in.. JMO
Tom Gitto |
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Clarks Hill Tournaments
